If You Don’t Want To Comment On This Post, I’ll Forgive You. If You Ask Nicely, That Is.

Let me begin by admitting that I have issues with forgiveness. Not with giving it, exactly. And not with receiving it, either.

My problems with forgiveness revolve around definitions of terms, I guess. Am I really asking for forgiveness when I say to my friend, "I'm sorry you feel like I hurt you?" Or am I begging to be understood? Am I really being sincere when I'm caught off-guard by the offended, who makes my sins known to me in no uncertain terms and taps their fingers on the table until I say the magic words, "Will you forgive me?"

There are so many nuances involved in the art of forgiveness, so many fine lines when it comes to discerning my own motives, that I'm often more confused after a session of supposed forgiveness than I was before.

It seems I'm always struggling in my heart to forgive people who've neither asked for my forgiveness nor apparently believe that they've offended me in the manner in which I feel offended. Do you know what I mean?

Have you ever sweat bullets while preparing a heartfelt apology for something you said or did, and then when you delivered it with every ounce of sincerity in your being, the other person said, "I don't know what you're talking about. I don't even remember you saying that..."

That's happened to me so many times, I've lost count. And I'm never sure if the people are telling the truth, or if they just feel really uncomfortable admitting that I've offended them. And then I always end up wondering if they're really offended at me after all, only they're offended about something I've said or done that I'm completely unaware of!

One time when I was a relative newcomer to forgiveness, a friend asked me to meet her for coffee, and she proceeded to list (in alphabetical order, if I remember right...) everything I'd ever done to hurt her. Here I thought we were going for the French silk pie, and instead each sentence out of her mouth started with, "And then there was the time..."

Of the fifteen or twenty specific charges she brought against me, I only identified with one of them. "You don't like my dog." Well, she had me there. At the end of the session, I asked for forgiveness--for what, I still can't say. She said she was so glad we'd gotten together, and that she felt so much better after we talked. I cried for a week.

My one consolation, then and now, is that Jesus isn't confused about forgiveness at all. He made it the purpose of His life on this earth, in fact. He who caused people to be offended only with the shame of their own sins, since He committed none with which to offend them, also forgave them right up to His dying breath--first the thief hanging next to Him, and then those who crucified Him, because they knew not what they'd done. And when the Scripture says that He's now seated at the right hand of the Father, making intercession for us sinners, well...I believe.

Still, when it comes to me and other humans, I'm confused.

Do you have issues with forgiveness? Do you ask for it everytime you're "sorry," or just when you really intend to change your behavior? Do you have people in your life who ask regularly for forgiveness? Do you have any idea on earth what subject they're on?

Or is it just me?

Posted by Katy on 03/09/05 at 09:02 PM

Fallible Comments...

Katy,
I can relate -- especially to your experience with your friend over French Silk pie! Some of the best advice a dear friend gave to me is this: when someone says something or does something that hurts you, assume that it was unintentional and let it go. Most of the things we get offended over are so small, and we can literally choose to take offense or not to take offense. If we don't take offense, there won't be any list we need to dump on our friend to make ourselves feel better. When someone does that, it is more about themselves than the relationship. I know there are times when it is intentional, and then we will have to decide what to do. But I think the majority is the opposite -- little comments or actions that stem from our own bad day or miscommunication. How we handle it is up to us.
-----
Posted by Carrie K. on 03/10/05 at 04:17 AM
There were a lot of purposes in Jesus' coming to earth. One is spelled out in one of my favorites verses: Hebrews 4:15a

For we don't have a high priest who can't be touched with the feeling of our infirmities.

He knows what it's like to experience the weaknesses of body, of mind, of character, to feel empty and alone, to feel worthless, to feel defeated. He does because He felt it, if not in life then in His hours on the cross.
It feels so good to listen to Ray Charles because he made you feel like he knew the pain of lost love, of failure, of loneliness. It's like he's looking across the table at us and saying, "I know just how you feel, brother."
That's what we have in Jesus. He doesn't excuse but He does forgive. He sits down beside us, looks in our eyes, and says. "I know how you feel."
Posted by Angus Lewis on 03/10/05 at 06:24 AM
Twice on Sunday I offended. It was absolutely unintentional; I couldn't believe the offendeds could be so wrong about my intentions! I apologized, but, like you, left them feeling badly. After several hours of putting myself down, I decided that I should not be so offended by others (including my mother, a dear, but a dear with an uncareful mouth) because maybe it is unintentional when they offend me, too.
Posted by Lori Seaborg on 03/10/05 at 06:27 AM
OHMYGOSH! That same thing happened to me, only it was during those I-can't-take-communion-until-I'm-right-with-you times. So, there, in the midst of the church, my friend said, "I need to confess to you that I don't like you." Then she told me why. "There, I feel so much better," and off she went to take the elements. I left feeling slimed!

Why are women so weird?
Posted by relevantgirl on 03/10/05 at 02:01 PM
My campus minister says that if someone offends you or hurts you with their words, you have several options, only two of which are biblical: try to ignore it but secretly seethe about it, plot your revenge/strike back with your own hurtful words (I think some of this passive-agressive confrontation mentioned in comments and Katy's post might count as this), truly forgive them and forget it and not harbor it as ammunition for future arguments, or lovingly confront them. Guess which two are biblical. :) It's all easier said than done, though. Alas.
Posted by Bethany on 03/10/05 at 09:25 PM
Katy, I'm pretty sure it's just you. But I forgive you.
Posted by Michael OConnor on 03/11/05 at 06:07 PM
I really don't think I have offended too many folks, one of the advantages of being an introvert I suppose. Also having a small circle of close friends, most people I know also know my sense of humor and simply wouldn't get offended by me, much as I can't really be offended by them. They and I know whatever it was, wasn't meant to be hurtful.

However since I'm on the radio I do get calls from people who are offended by something I said, or something they heard (or thought they heard, or someone told them they heard) on the radio.

If it's something I said it's usually near an election and the "offended" party is no doubt upset by the coverage given a politician they don't like, or they believe their candidate's arrest for soliciting a prostitute or whatever "isn't news." Those folks I've learned I can't reason with. I apologize and blame someone else higher up like Dan Rather and they usually go away happy.

Many times people "mis-hear" things and once I read or play back exactly what was said they do a Rosanne Rosannadanna-like "nevermind" and hang up.

The folks who are invariably the MOST offended are usually upset because we didn't mention something. Almost always it's that we didn't mention a traffic jam they're in, that it's raining in their neighborhood, that the power is out on their block. The truth is they're offended we didn't mention information THEY ALREADY KNOW.

That's helped me immensely because I realized that people want to hear what they already know. So we do news about the weather being nice, or how there are too many potholes, and people relate.

My brother is the only person in my life who I offended to such a degree that he "disowned" me. He sent out an email to everyone in his address book urging them to vote for extremly liberal causes and I responded with a "reply to all" ... That was it. He was offended. I apologized and he was more offended. I forgave him and he got REALLY offended.

I figured he simply wants to be offended...in truth I think most people who get offended...want to and look for ways to accomplish that goal.

I hope that didn't offend anyone.

If it did.

Get over it.

-M
Posted by Michael Main on 03/12/05 at 01:37 AM
Ah, forgiveness...........no, you aren't the only one! I can relate to much of what you've said on the subject.

Forgiving is so not "easy" - often I can really drag my feet, telling God the "other one" doesn't deserve forgiveness. Ouch! (Was that You, God???) I know, I know, who of us DESERVES forgiveness? But, Lord, You REALLY don't know what that person DID! Well, I know You do know, but...! I struggle with forgiving a close family member at the moment for seven years of "offence" - I struggle with forgiving him because he has never said he was wrong and has never asked forgiveness and continues doing the same things. I have an on-going discussion with myself as to whether we can forgive someone who never ASKS for forgiveness. My husband and I differ on this - at least, we discuss it...I haven't yet decided on my position.

One thing I know for sure is that Jesus forgave those who crucified Him - and THEY didn't ask Him to forgive them, right? Maybe I've just answered my own question on the subject.
Posted by sandy on 03/12/05 at 02:36 AM

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Personal blog of christian writer & fallible mom Katy McKenna Raymond in Kansas City, Missouri Katy is represented by Greg Johnson at WordServe Literary Read more Katy at LateBoomer.net Follow Katy on Twitter Follow Katy on Facebook 123 Recent Posts Try Becoming Brenda Starr Off Beat Scattered That’s It So I’ve Finally Signed With An Agent. Now What? The Spoon Sciatica Sweetheart A Woman’s Train of Thought Has No Caboose However much we own, we are all still living on borrowed time After all, when restaurants shrink portions, they don’t shrink prices. As with everything in life, balance is key. Slow down, you move too fast… Yeah, I know. I have issues. Search Advanced Search Syndicate Login E me at katy @ ngenius.com	If You Don’t Want To Comment On This Post, I’ll Forgive You. If You Ask Nicely, That Is. Let me begin by admitting that I have issues with forgiveness. Not with giving it, exactly. And not with receiving it, either. My problems with forgiveness revolve around definitions of terms, I guess. Am I really asking for forgiveness when I say to my friend, "I'm sorry you feel like I hurt you?" Or am I begging to be understood? Am I really being sincere when I'm caught off-guard by the offended, who makes my sins known to me in no uncertain terms and taps their fingers on the table until I say the magic words, "Will you forgive me?" There are so many nuances involved in the art of forgiveness, so many fine lines when it comes to discerning my own motives, that I'm often more confused after a session of supposed forgiveness than I was before. It seems I'm always struggling in my heart to forgive people who've neither asked for my forgiveness nor apparently believe that they've offended me in the manner in which I feel offended. Do you know what I mean? Have you ever sweat bullets while preparing a heartfelt apology for something you said or did, and then when you delivered it with every ounce of sincerity in your being, the other person said, "I don't know what you're talking about. I don't even remember you saying that..." That's happened to me so many times, I've lost count. And I'm never sure if the people are telling the truth, or if they just feel really uncomfortable admitting that I've offended them. And then I always end up wondering if they're really offended at me after all, only they're offended about something I've said or done that I'm completely unaware of! One time when I was a relative newcomer to forgiveness, a friend asked me to meet her for coffee, and she proceeded to list (in alphabetical order, if I remember right...) everything I'd ever done to hurt her. Here I thought we were going for the French silk pie, and instead each sentence out of her mouth started with, "And then there was the time..." Of the fifteen or twenty specific charges she brought against me, I only identified with one of them. "You don't like my dog." Well, she had me there. At the end of the session, I asked for forgiveness--for what, I still can't say. She said she was so glad we'd gotten together, and that she felt so much better after we talked. I cried for a week. My one consolation, then and now, is that Jesus isn't confused about forgiveness at all. He made it the purpose of His life on this earth, in fact. He who caused people to be offended only with the shame of their own sins, since He committed none with which to offend them, also forgave them right up to His dying breath--first the thief hanging next to Him, and then those who crucified Him, because they knew not what they'd done. And when the Scripture says that He's now seated at the right hand of the Father, making intercession for us sinners, well...I believe. Still, when it comes to me and other humans, I'm confused. Do you have issues with forgiveness? Do you ask for it everytime you're "sorry," or just when you really intend to change your behavior? Do you have people in your life who ask regularly for forgiveness? Do you have any idea on earth what subject they're on? Or is it just me? Posted by Katy on 03/09/05 at 09:02 PM Fallible Comments... Katy, I can relate -- especially to your experience with your friend over French Silk pie! Some of the best advice a dear friend gave to me is this: when someone says something or does something that hurts you, assume that it was unintentional and let it go. Most of the things we get offended over are so small, and we can literally choose to take offense or not to take offense. If we don't take offense, there won't be any list we need to dump on our friend to make ourselves feel better. When someone does that, it is more about themselves than the relationship. I know there are times when it is intentional, and then we will have to decide what to do. But I think the majority is the opposite -- little comments or actions that stem from our own bad day or miscommunication. How we handle it is up to us. ----- Posted by Carrie K. on 03/10/05 at 04:17 AM There were a lot of purposes in Jesus' coming to earth. One is spelled out in one of my favorites verses: Hebrews 4:15a For we don't have a high priest who can't be touched with the feeling of our infirmities. He knows what it's like to experience the weaknesses of body, of mind, of character, to feel empty and alone, to feel worthless, to feel defeated. He does because He felt it, if not in life then in His hours on the cross. It feels so good to listen to Ray Charles because he made you feel like he knew the pain of lost love, of failure, of loneliness. It's like he's looking across the table at us and saying, "I know just how you feel, brother." That's what we have in Jesus. He doesn't excuse but He does forgive. He sits down beside us, looks in our eyes, and says. "I know how you feel." Posted by Angus Lewis on 03/10/05 at 06:24 AM Twice on Sunday I offended. It was absolutely unintentional; I couldn't believe the offendeds could be so wrong about my intentions! I apologized, but, like you, left them feeling badly. After several hours of putting myself down, I decided that I should not be so offended by others (including my mother, a dear, but a dear with an uncareful mouth) because maybe it is unintentional when they offend me, too. Posted by Lori Seaborg on 03/10/05 at 06:27 AM OHMYGOSH! That same thing happened to me, only it was during those I-can't-take-communion-until-I'm-right-with-you times. So, there, in the midst of the church, my friend said, "I need to confess to you that I don't like you." Then she told me why. "There, I feel so much better," and off she went to take the elements. I left feeling slimed! Why are women so weird? Posted by relevantgirl on 03/10/05 at 02:01 PM My campus minister says that if someone offends you or hurts you with their words, you have several options, only two of which are biblical: try to ignore it but secretly seethe about it, plot your revenge/strike back with your own hurtful words (I think some of this passive-agressive confrontation mentioned in comments and Katy's post might count as this), truly forgive them and forget it and not harbor it as ammunition for future arguments, or lovingly confront them. Guess which two are biblical. :) It's all easier said than done, though. Alas. Posted by Bethany on 03/10/05 at 09:25 PM Katy, I'm pretty sure it's just you. But I forgive you. Posted by Michael OConnor on 03/11/05 at 06:07 PM I really don't think I have offended too many folks, one of the advantages of being an introvert I suppose. Also having a small circle of close friends, most people I know also know my sense of humor and simply wouldn't get offended by me, much as I can't really be offended by them. They and I know whatever it was, wasn't meant to be hurtful. However since I'm on the radio I do get calls from people who are offended by something I said, or something they heard (or thought they heard, or someone told them they heard) on the radio. If it's something I said it's usually near an election and the "offended" party is no doubt upset by the coverage given a politician they don't like, or they believe their candidate's arrest for soliciting a prostitute or whatever "isn't news." Those folks I've learned I can't reason with. I apologize and blame someone else higher up like Dan Rather and they usually go away happy. Many times people "mis-hear" things and once I read or play back exactly what was said they do a Rosanne Rosannadanna-like "nevermind" and hang up. The folks who are invariably the MOST offended are usually upset because we didn't mention something. Almost always it's that we didn't mention a traffic jam they're in, that it's raining in their neighborhood, that the power is out on their block. The truth is they're offended we didn't mention information THEY ALREADY KNOW. That's helped me immensely because I realized that people want to hear what they already know. So we do news about the weather being nice, or how there are too many potholes, and people relate. My brother is the only person in my life who I offended to such a degree that he "disowned" me. He sent out an email to everyone in his address book urging them to vote for extremly liberal causes and I responded with a "reply to all" ... That was it. He was offended. I apologized and he was more offended. I forgave him and he got REALLY offended. I figured he simply wants to be offended...in truth I think most people who get offended...want to and look for ways to accomplish that goal. I hope that didn't offend anyone. If it did. Get over it. -M Posted by Michael Main on 03/12/05 at 01:37 AM Ah, forgiveness...........no, you aren't the only one! I can relate to much of what you've said on the subject. Forgiving is so not "easy" - often I can really drag my feet, telling God the "other one" doesn't deserve forgiveness. Ouch! (Was that You, God???) I know, I know, who of us DESERVES forgiveness? But, Lord, You REALLY don't know what that person DID! Well, I know You do know, but...! I struggle with forgiving a close family member at the moment for seven years of "offence" - I struggle with forgiving him because he has never said he was wrong and has never asked forgiveness and continues doing the same things. I have an on-going discussion with myself as to whether we can forgive someone who never ASKS for forgiveness. My husband and I differ on this - at least, we discuss it...I haven't yet decided on my position. One thing I know for sure is that Jesus forgave those who crucified Him - and THEY didn't ask Him to forgive them, right? Maybe I've just answered my own question on the subject. Posted by sandy on 03/12/05 at 02:36 AM Page 1 of 1 pages Commenting is not available in this weblog entry. Next entry: Saturdays With(out) Kevin Previous entry: Sacked << Back to main


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If You Don’t Want To Comment On This Post, I’ll Forgive You. If You Ask Nicely, That Is.

Personal blog of christian
writer & fallible mom
Katy McKenna Raymond
in Kansas City, Missouri